Talking With Captain ( Don Van Vliet ) Beefheart
Neither Freak Nor Hero Be
By Mike McGrath
"Everybody's colored or you wouldn't be able to see them.'' – Don Van Vliet
Last week I had a luncheon interview with Don Van Vliet, better known to the world as Captain Beefheart. What began as an interview gradually developed into an 11 hour talk-fight-discussion agreement which left me with a great deal more respect for the Captain than I had before.
Don always interjects the words "I'm just teasing", or " I'm just kidding." But he isn't. He has a lot to say – much of it important – all of it interesting.
MM – Your concert is tomorrow night, but you were here a week ago. How come you're in town so early?
DVV – I had the choice of either coming here early or staying in Boston. And I wanted to meet a lot of the people that Meatball knew – that Tom (Tom Lopez, ala Meatball Fulton) told me about. He said there were a lot of heavy writers and a lot of heavy radio people here – and he told me that about three years ago. And now I thought it was time that I met them.
MM – I just found out a few days ago that you knew Tom. About when did you meet him?
DVV – About three years ago. He came out to the house and we had a great conversation. And he's the guy that told me that what I had was poetry – cause I 'd been writing for three years – and he said 'what you have here is very very great poetry.' And I said that I thought it was just a bunch of writing on a piece of paper.
MM – How were you supporting yourself back then?
DVV – Well, I was having a hell of a time – just barely scraping by playing various little clubs in L.A. I couldn't even get enough money for an amplifier. Like – we completely rehearsed Trout Mask Replica on electric guitars – but we didn't have any amplifiers.
Rockett Morton (bass player for the band) – We played 16 or 18 hours a day acoustically. I used a Fender Jazz. Bass.
MM – Yeah. I've heard that you practice like all day long.
DVV – I never have in my life – they did.
RM – Yeah, the rest of the group did – then we went into the studio and did the album Trout Mask Replica in four and a half hours. That's about 28 cuts. We could've done it quicker – we were so pressed for time – but we had to do two or three takes on some of the cuts.
DVV – That's Zappa. The son of a bitch.
MM – What's your relationship been with Zappa?
DVV – I'm an artist, man. Zappa's no artist. He came to me and asked me if I wanted to be on his label, and I asked him what he could tell me about the label. He said I would get complete artistic freedom. I would be treated in a very above-board manner. I would get good distribution, and I would get all or my money.
MM – What about the money?
DVV – Zappa said 'You'll get all of your money because I'm a friend of yours.' I haven't gotten a penny. Nor has anybody in my group ever gotten a penny.
MM – But Trout Mask Replica did sell ...
DVV – Of course it did – it's all over the place. You've seen it – so have I. But they claim it didn't sell.
MM – So you think you're being taken then.
DVV – I know I am. But I'm not being taken – he is. Because he shouldn't have done that to me. Cause people won't like that ... I'll tell you. And I don't lie ... Don't ask me – ask Alice Cooper. Alice Cooper didn't get their money either.
MM – What do you consider important about yourself? What have you wanted to see in print about you besides the usual 'Do you and your group really run around dressed in sheets?' and other such shit?
DVV – Well, first off is the fact that I never allowed anybody to tell me that they turned me on. You see – I knew that I was on when I breathed air when I was a baby – and due to that fact I'm an artist.
DVV – Does that make any sense to you? It hasn't made me a penny in seven years. No. I'm just kidding. I'm not kidding really.
Bui somehow this new album has slipped in and people are buying it. Why, I don't know. I don't know why they didn't buy Trout Mask Replica. I think they're buying The Spotlight Kid because of the feeling. It's the best feeling I've had on an album.
MM – What about Trout Mask?
DVV – That was rushed. Zappa didn't have time for my art statement. It bothered him that I was making an art statement.
MM – What was the deal with Bizarre-Straight Records, anyway?
DVV – The deal was that they didn't have their shit together. And they shouldn't have invited me on their label as an artist and then try and delude me into being some sort or freak. I'm an artist – not a freak. I don't think there is such a thing as a freak ...
You see, I was on Straight Records – which was supposed to be a Straight product. Then there was Bizarre – they were the people who didn't have what it took, or didn't think that they did – to make it on their own. Then Zappa switched me over to that label – which was a definite breach of his good word to me. Which makes his word not very good to me.
It caused a lot of trouble for me, because a lot of people thought I was doing freak music and took hard narcotics to get into it. But we don't take narcotics, and didn't take narcotics while we were doing the album. So therefore, I wanted people to hear it without narcotics.
MM – What do you mean when you say narcotics?
DVV – Hard drugs.
MM – 'Hard' meaning anything more than grass or hash?
DVV – Yeah, speed, heroin. Anything that is going to delude your mind.
MM – Well, to a certain extent even that daquiri will delude your mind.
DVV – Correct. But the thing is – I've had one daquiri in maybe 10 years. Very seldom do I drink. I might have four drinks in four years. But I smoke cigarettes – which is ridiculous. But the thing is – I started smoking cigarettes to relate to my father. I was a sculptor and he couldn't understand me. So, I figured that the least I could do is have a cigarette. I'll take a little poison in order for us to get along a little bit better. Which is ridiculous. And now I have a habit, but I'm breaking it. And I will break it – but I'll do it slow. I don't want to be real radical about it. I started slow and I'll finish slow. But I want to quit smoking because I don't like the idea of being attached to a habit.
But I'm not trying to set any examples – because I don't believe in examples, isms, or heroes.
MM – There's too many heroes already.
DVV – Well, there are no heroes, but there's a lot of people who would like to think they are.
Don Van Vliet is a remarkable guy – friendly, warm, intelligent. Captain Beefheart, Don Van Vliet – neither one is a freak. Both did two shows at Penn's Irvine Hall last week and proved what they were – they're artists man. And I'm not kidding.